With an outstanding broadcasting career behind her, Edith Bowman knows a thing or two about creating engaging audio. We caught up with the host of Soundtracking to talk about laughing too loudly, now knowing too much and using your initiative. 

If you could go back to before you started out and give yourself one piece of advice, what would it be?

Don’t laugh too loudly. It makes me cringe when I hear my laugh. I guess I get carried away, which is only a good thing.

What do you think makes a great podcast guest?

Someone willing to have a conversation and allow that conversation to go wherever it may go. To not follow the usual premeditated answers that have been practised for a press tour. That’s why I love getting people out of that cycle.

What’s the secret to being a good podcast host?

Passion, genuine passion. I also think not being too informed on the subject. I’m a music and film fan, I know stuff but not everything and I like to learn from every guest, which I definitely do.

What’s been your worst podcast moment so far?

When I got home after interviewing directors Valerie Farris and Jonathan Denton who had just released Battle of the Sexes and something happened to the audio, there was this constant whine that meant it was unusable. I crawled to the PR people and asked if there was any way I could get another 20 mins with them. Knowing they were off to Europe to do more press, I was willing to jump on a plane or train to do it. Thankfully they had another screening the following night and very kindly said come along and we can chat after that. They were such good sports and very gracious and generous with their time.

Why podcasting? What is it about the podcast format that appeals to you?

The good ones are very intimate and the best ones make you feel involved in the conversation, like you are in the room with them. The worst ones are where you can tell that the host/s just love the sound of their own voices and their opinions are the only opinions. Immediate turn off for me.

What is your podcast/podcaster pet peeve?

Well it’s a funny one. The biggest compliment should be when people try and imitate what you do, but it doesn’t stop you from feeling a little pissed off that someone has basically ripped off your idea. They just wish they’d come up with it first and did it half as well as you do.

Is there anything you found annoying as a listener but then understood when you started making your own podcast?

Not really no. It’s such a wonderful world and opportunity for people to explore and share their passions and stories. Mine came out of sheer frustration. I did a similar show on 6Music, my idea that I came up with, they wouldn’t give me a regular slot, as I knew I could give them a really good guest every week. So I said, fuck it, i’m going to do it myself. That is the amazing thing about podcasts.

Which one episode of your podcast mean the most to you?

Well there are two. The episode we recorded with Jon Favreau was our first ever and I am forever in his debt for being so enthusiastic and willing to jump on board with us. And then our very first episode with Ben Wheatley, he’s such a great supporter of the podcast, we appreciate his love so much. He’s been on three times now!

Finally, which podcast episode not of your own means the most to you?

Oh man that’s a hard one. The one that has made me laugh the most and that I’ve probably listened to the most would be The Adam Buxton Podcast episode with Louis Theroux, the one where they drink an energy drink and get more and more wired the longer the chat goes on for. Genius and a great one to listen to on the tube, laughing out loud and making people think you are mad.

In Soundtracking, Edith Bowman sits down with a variety of film directors, actors, producers and composers to talk about the music that inspired them and how they use music in their films, from their current release to key moments in their career. Subscribe now on Acast, Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts. Follow Edith on Twitter @Edibow

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Tell us about your show! What’s your elevator pitch??

First of all I would never pitch anything in an elevator. We’re way above that now. I’d probably get the Best Podcast award that we won out of my bag and just hold it out in front of me and then when the other people in the lift ask “why have you got that award?” I’d explain; We do an award winning podcast called The Kurupt FM Podkast where we talk about different topics and help you to understand them. The best way to describe it is probably it’s like injecting pure knowledge directly into your brain using headphones.

Why podcasting? What is it about the format that appeals to you?

We’d been running our pirate radio station for years, blazing out the finest UK garage across the land of Brentford. After we stopped doing Kurupt FM everyone was understandably heartbroken and wanted to hear our voices again. Then our manager, Chabuddy G, told us about these things Audible do called podcasts, which are basically like pirate radio shows, but much, much more boring. I decided that it was time for us to make podcasts credible and at the same time bring our voices to a nation of desperate fans. Also Chabzy said it was a good way for him to advertise shit to gullible people. So everyone wins, really. One thing that’s good about podcasts is that the reach is a little bit wider than pirate radio. Our reach used to be a two mile radius from the block where our aerial was but with the Podkast you can get wherever which is pretty mad.

What’s the secret to being a good podcast host?

Be yourself. Unless you’re boring. Some podcast hosts are proper boring, which is probably why the whole podcast thing hasn’t really taken off until now. The secret to being a good podcast host is to provide wisdom and have natural lyrical talent. That’s why Audible approached me. Good looks aren’t essential cos it’s just audio but there’s nothing I can do about that. They get that for free.

What do you think makes a great podcast guest?

Make sure you recognise and respect the podcast host and above all know your place. Stepping into someone’s podcast is like coming into their home. Take your shoes off on your way in, have some respect, wipe the seat if you use the toilet. That’s a metaphor, Steve’s toilet doesn’t actually work. If you need a piss you have to walk around the corner to the leisure centre or McDonalds.

If you could go back to before you started out and give yourself one piece of advice, what would it be?

We actually discuss time travel as part of the episode about the future. I can say from experience that the idea of going back and talking to yourself is not something I would recommend. It’s better to not interfere in that stuff cos you don’t know what sort of madness you might end up doing. Look at Back To The Future. One minute it seems like a great idea, the next minute you’re like Marty McFly and you’re accidentally about to have sex with your own mum. No thanks.

What’s been your worst podcast moment so far?

Last series we did a Ouija board and accidentally opened the door into the spirit world. That was quite long. I don’t believe in all that stuff obviously but when you blaze loads of weed it’s hard not to sometimes get paro… Steve still burns sage in his flat once a week just in case there’s still spirits knocking about.

Which episode of episodes of your podcast mean the most to you?

The episode where I finally reveal the script for the film I’ve been writing about my life. MC Grindah: The Movie. We acted out some of the scenes and it was really emotional for me to see it come to life. Idris Elba, if you’re seeing this, and I’m sure you are – the part of MC Grindah is still up for grabs. Everyone says we’re basically twins so it’s the role of a lifetime for you, I’m not sure why you’ve been ignoring our messages. Maybe you’re in the gym bulking up, trying to get my shoulders.

Which podcasts of podcast hosts inspire you most?

I don’t listen to podcasts to be honest, they’re mainly for brears who drink coffee and have folding bikes and suits with running trainers that want something to listen to on the tube. So I’d probably have to say myself. And I inspire those around me as well so in a way I’m inspired by them because they’re inspired by me.

Finally, what are your current favourite podcasts?

Hmm. Tough one. I think I’d have to say The Kurupt FM Podkast. And if it’s not your favourite then you’re wrong cos we literally have an award to prove that it’s the best one. It’s mad actually cos I never was a fan of podcasts before but I have single-handedly converted myself into a podcast fan.

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Podcasts have become a hub for entertainment and amusement, or indeed a place of learning, but they’ve also taken on a role of outreach. There are certain challenges that we collectively face in today’s world, but podcasts are putting conversations on a global stage. We now have a whole sector with a social conscience in the podcast world. Pod Bible aims to shine a spotlight on these causes.

Learning To Adult Slowly is a podcast hosted by rap artist Professor Green and its aim is to address the many aspects faced by men today, such as body image, mental health, grief, and resilience. Produced by The Book of Man, a website that aims to open up the dialogue around mental health – and for which Professor Green is a columnist – the Learning to Adult Slowly podcast is a natural spin-off. So how did it all come about?

Martin Robinson, founder and editor of The Book of Man explains why he initially took such an interest in our collective mental health.

“I had the idea for it after losing my previous magazine job and finding myself at home, discovering the joys of being a stay at home Dad, but also quite isolated and bewildered and emotionally bruised. It occurred to me that there was nothing out there to really support men internally as well as externally – nothing genuinely dealing with the ‘masculinity crisis’, which wasn’t just a pop culture joke but a genuine result of a digital age shifting in social roles at home and work, exacerbated by recession and resulting in terrifying figures for male suicide, mental health issues, addiction, violence, sexual dysfunction, and eating disorders.”

The figures speak for themselves. The Campaign Against Living Miserably (CALM) is a support network for mental health and according to their website suicide is the single biggest killer of men aged under 45 in the UK. In 2015, 75% of all UK suicides were male. During a live recording of Learning to Adult Slowly, with guests consisting of Scroobius Pip, comedian Kelly Convey, and CALM CEO Simon Gunning, the panel were keen to point out that males under the age of 45 are statistically more likely to be at risk from dying due to self-harm than any other way, including road traffic deaths. What can we do to keep the conversation going?

Martin Robinson says:

“Having Professor Green as our columnist on Book of Man and also the host of the Learning to Adult Slowly podcast has been wonderful in exemplifying the kind of issues we want to deal with – the issues that aren’t better left unsaid. His writing about grief, meds, violence, fear, vulnerability, is remarkable and much needed. But bringing that into the podcast arena has given it another dimension, as well as a bigger repeat audience. Real conversations with people on these areas really makes them hit home. And you realise everyone has in some way been affected by such matters. The mere fact that you can listen to people talking about the most difficult moments in their life is remarkable. The reaction we had was immediate and positive”

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If you could go back to just before you recorded the first episode of your podcast and give yourself one piece of advice, what would it be?

Find a good editor. I love the free flowing nature of podcast conversations, but most of them can be improved with some judicial chopping. I get the appeal of a long unedited ramble with someone fascinating, but we can’t all be Joe Rogan or Terry Gross, and most hosts (myself very much included) aren’t good enough to sustain a good conversation/interview over one hour, let alone 2 or 3. Most people don’t have time to actually listen to a show that long anyway. I like something that’s been honed and presented with an appreciation for what can be done with audio.

What makes a great podcast guest?

Someone who is good at talking about themselves, enjoys a conversation and doesn’t care too much how people will respond to what they say. Kathy Burke springs to mind, or Louis Theroux. But I also like the occasional guest who is basically just telling a story or a series of stories and isn’t really interested in talking to me. If their stories are well told, it’s a nice change and I get to relax!

What makes a great podcast host?

I like podcasters who are genuinely interested in their guests and don’t just sit there waiting for the next opportunity to do a joke or talk about themselves. I have certainly been guilty of both those things. Sometimes I think it’s OK, as long as the guest is on board and is happy to go back and forth with you like that, but if you don’t know the person very well, it’s important to make it clear to them that you’re listening to what they have to say and that they can relax. The goal is to get a conversation flowing. If that starts happening then you can start cautiously lobbing in your own bullshit.

What’s been your worst podcast moment?

There have been some disappointments with guests who I thought I would get on well with but turned out to be guarded or just not in the mood for a conversation with me. I went to Los Angeles a couple of years back to do a few podcasts and some shows, but the impetus for the trip was the opportunity to talk to a musical hero of mine. However when I finally sat down with them, they just went off on a series of impenetrably esoteric monologues, then got annoyed when I tried to bring the conversation round to their music or anything more than 5 people might find interesting. That day was frustrating on so many levels, but I was mainly irritated with myself for failing. I’d seen that person do great interviews with other people but I failed to get the best out of them.

Unfortunately there are often times when I’m having an off day and do a lousy job of taking a conversation somewhere interesting or maybe the guest just isn’t in the mood. Often those episodes don’t come out. Now I try to warn guests that not every episode gets released so they don’t take it personally if theirs doesn’t end up appearing. The best podcasters are consistently good with all their guests. I’m not there yet.

What is it about podcasts that appeals to you?

I like hearing a conversation unfold. I like the tangents and the irrelevancies that you couldn’t get away with on TV or radio where everyone and everything tends to be boiled down to its most unambiguous version. The long form podcast conversation offers the possibility of hearing something more nuanced, messy and more true to real life than you’d get anywhere else. It’s a chance to get to know a stranger in quite a meaningful way. There’s something that feels good about that, especially in these strange times.

What is your podcast/podcaster pet peeve?

This is a very superficial peeve that I’m not proud of, but I don’t like the croaky voice some podcasters favour. This is a huge generalisation, but I’ve found it’s often younger people doing more journalistic pieces on American podcasts who tend to do the croaky voice most. It sounds contrived, as though they have, consciously or unconsciously, adopted that way of speaking because they think it somehow signifies intimacy and intelligence, so the listener will feel they’re in bed with an intellectual. There’s enough intellectuals in my bed already, thanks.

Personally I also find very long intros wearying. It’s a fine balance, because many listeners like hearing about the host/hosts and what they’ve been up to, but for someone who’s just downloaded an episode because they’re interested in the guest or the main topic, it can easily come off as offensively indulgent and boring. Sometimes I’ll do a longer intro if there are bits of the conversation I think need setting up with a little background info or if I have a particular story I want to tell that I think people might enjoy, but increasingly I try to put most of the more personal waffling at the end, for the hardcore!

Is there anything you found annoying as a podcast listener… but then understood when you started making your own?

Well, the long intro thing – if you don’t script your intros and you’re just freestyling, it’s VERY easy to talk for 10 or 15 minutes and tell yourself it’s all good stuff, but almost always it would be better if it was at least half as long. You also realise how hard it is to get guests who haven’t been on everybody else’s podcast, but I don’t think most people care about that too much any more.

Which one podcast episode of your own means the most to you?

That’s like asking me to pick a favourite child! OK, technically it’s not, because we’re talking about podcasts not children, but it’s still tough. All the episodes are quite different and it really depends what mood you’re in. Well of course the Scroobius Pip episode (EP.07) was particularly good! I really liked the Mae Martin one (EP.50) because I didn’t really know her before we sat down and over the course of the conversation I just liked her more and more, which hopefully comes across to the listener. I’d say the same about Diane Morgan too (EP.65) – a very different kind of personality but so surprising and funny. I mentioned Louis Theroux (EP.01, 29, 49, 81) and Kathy Burke (EP.15, 56) before, they’re always so entertaining and interesting. Zadie Smith (EP.40) was a thrill and I hope our conversation was a little different to most interviews she gives, and the same could be said for Paul Thomas Anderson (EP.63). Hassan Akkad’s story of coming to the UK from Syria as a refugee (EP.57) was fascinating and told brilliantly by him and it was very exciting to talk to David Sedaris (EP.79). And Brian Eno!

Shit… I can’t narrow it down to just one, but three of my favourites, which I’ve listened back to and felt really happy with were Romesh Ranganathan (EP.61) Tash Demetriou (EP. 32 & EP.82) and Tim Key (EP.77). Yes, I know that’s four.

Which one podcast episode not of your own means the most to you?

Some of Bob Mortimer’s ‘Gangs Of The EPL’ playlets on Athletico Mince have REALLY made me laugh and stayed with me. I think Bob likes a lot of the same things as me in comedy – weird accents, stupid songs and talking about mundane routines. When he’s on a roll I can’t think of too many people who are funnier.

Read more Gospel According To… articles in the Pod Bible magazine, which you can read online or buy in our shop. You can subscribe to The Adam Buxton Podcast on Acast, or via Adam-buxton.co.uk.

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